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.NET Forum / Languages / Managed C++ / December 2003What type of c++ should I use?
Hey, My experience with c++ is limited to ATL and for the past 3 years it's just been c#. I need to write a UI intensive application that is just too slow in managed code. So I'm re-doing it in unmanaged c++, what should I use in vc++ 7, ATL, MFC or Win32? thanks Craig Borland C++ builder is the best C++ tool for GUI development. You can develop com servers using VisStudio and call these com servers from Borland developed GUI. >-----Original Message----- >Hey, [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > >. Good old borland, never thought of them. What makes their product good at GUI stuff? Are they actually going to be around for much longer? ;-) C > Borland C++ builder is the best C++ tool for GUI > development. You can develop com servers using VisStudio [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > > >. Borland VCL (Visual Component Library) is the perfect collection of VB stile GUI components vor C++. Most recent version Borland C++ builder 6 was released less then year ego. Check http://www.borland.com Regards >-----Original Message----- >Good old borland, never thought of them. What makes their product good at [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > >. > Borland VCL (Visual Component Library) is the perfect > collection of VB stile GUI components vor C++. Most recent > version Borland C++ builder 6 was released less then year > ego. Check http://www.borland.com First of all, more than a year ago, second of all there will be no more VCL updates (they're going to wxwindows). And third, builder is extremely bug ridden Good lack with UpdateData() crap. >-----Original Message----- >> Borland VCL (Visual Component Library) is the perfect [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >. > [...] > First of all, more than a year ago, second of all there will be no more VCL > updates (they're going to wxwindows). And third, builder is extremely bug > ridden VCL is a Delphi class library for which there's a C++ interface. AFAIK, the next VCL thing in the making is to create a .NET version of it. IIRC, plans are to get a new native VCL out afterwards. While the new C++BuilderX doesn't come with a visual designer, it does compile BCB6 applications out of the box. Also, it's planned to have more RAD support (including VCL RAD support) in later versions. Check out the open letter at http://bdn.borland.com/article/0,1410,31277,00.html Schobi  SignatureSpamTrap@gmx.de is never read I'm Schobi at suespammers org "And why should I know better by now/When I'm old enough not to?" Beth Orton I wouldn't go with Borland and vcl. Very outdated stuff. > Good old borland, never thought of them. What makes their product good at > GUI stuff? [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > > > > >. > I wouldn't go with Borland and vcl. Very outdated stuff. The VCl was last updated with Delphi 7, IIRC correctly, that was less than a year ago. > [...] Schobi SignatureSpamTrap@gmx.de is never read I'm Schobi at suespammers org "And why should I know better by now/When I'm old enough not to?" Beth Orton You're probably going to get a variety of answers to this "subjective" question. in my opinion MFC is a good thing to learn. It is a pretty thin layer on the Win32 API with lots of helper classes. MSFT has said that they will continue to support and improve MFC for the forseeable future so the investment in time to learn it will not be a waste. My two pesos... Tom > Hey, > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > thanks > Craig thanks! Craig > You're probably going to get a variety of answers to this "subjective" > question. in my opinion MFC is a good thing to learn. It is a pretty thin [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > thanks > > Craig > You're probably going to get a variety of answers to this "subjective" > question. in my opinion MFC is a good thing to learn. It is a pretty thin > layer on the Win32 API with lots of helper classes. MSFT has said that they > will continue to support and improve MFC for the forseeable future so the > investment in time to learn it will not be a waste. MFC is (right after DirectX) the most crappy API I've ever seen. It is neither thin nor easy to learn. I think support for MFC will stop in the next few years and they will only support and develop on .NET Windows.Forms. IIRC, in 2004 they will release new GUI components for .NET with a brand new API. Maybe third party platform independent GUI classes for C++ are worth a look, but I've never tried them. -- cody [Freeware, Games and Humor] www.deutronium.de.vu || www.deutronium.tk > I think support for MFC will stop in the next few years and they will > only support and develop on .NET Windows.Forms. This is not correct. Microsoft plans on supporting MFC for the foreseeable future. We are working to make sure that MFC applications are able to take advantage of new APIs in the .NET frameworks and WinFX. > IIRC, in 2004 they will release new GUI components for .NET with a brand > new API. Microsoft is introducing a new presentation API to Windows, but this is not being released in 2004 (it is likely going to be in Beta though). Just as MFC is an abstraction over the Win32 presentation APIs, it is very likely that other libraries will be developed to abstract the WinFX APIs. SignatureBrandon Bray http://blogs.gotdotnet.com/branbray/ This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights. You may want to consider the WTL, the Windows Template Library. Here one place to start learning about it: http://www.codeproject.com/wtl/ I'm guessing an ATL programmer will feel right at home with it. I'd consider MFC only if you'll need third-part components (like Dundas, Stingray, etc...) > Hey, > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > thanks > Craig Hi, Our company uses C#, Delphi and occasionally MFC for apps and to be quite honest I wouldn't have said that there was much perceptible difference between them as far as UI speed was concerned (except for the slight 'first time JIT compile' issue with C#). I am a bit curious as to what you might be doing with C# that makes the UI seem so slow? Cheers Doug Forster > Hey, > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > thanks > Craig Hi, Well to start have you tried running SharpDevelop? It is written in c# and is a memory hog and is pretty slow - no offense to the SharpDevelop developers ;-) me being one of them! The company I work for also has an IDE for their core product and it is entirely written in c# and is also a memory hog and pretty much drives a PIV, 512Meg machine into the ground. The application I'm working on is for my Phd in soft. dev. and I just don't want to spend years writing it to find its slow ;-) Most people seem to believe the speed difference between an MFC app and c# isn't worth the extra development time. thanks Craig > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > thanks > > Craig > Well to start have you tried running SharpDevelop? It is written in c# and > is a memory hog and is pretty slow - no offense to the SharpDevelop [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > the speed difference between an MFC app and c# isn't worth the extra > development time. If you want speed and lightweight go for a full blown win32 app. It might be more cryptic than MFC or other similar frameworks, but it's the best tool for making fast and lightweight applications. All other methods use the API down under anyways. Alex. > My experience with c++ is limited to ATL and for the past 3 years > it's just been c#. I need to write a UI intensive application that is > just too slow in managed code. So I'm re-doing it in unmanaged c++, If you know ATL and C++ well (including templates), you will be happy using WTL. Start here http://www.codeproject.com/wtl/ or here http://www.idevresource.com/wtl/ . WTL is heavely templated (ie. no runtime overhead, like MFC) thin object oriented wrapper around Win32 API GUI functions. Most (if not all) of its classes are derived from ATL classes. I do not know how it fits complex GUI applications (probably it does, due to elegant design), but it's worth a try. B. 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