C# and Web 3

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Logician - 22 Mar 2008 06:18 GMT

Does anyone have details from Microsoft(eg press statements) about its
commitment to C# and Web 3 technologies?

Specifically, the role of C# and the use of RDF, Microformats and a
higher level of data encapsulation.

Some useful links:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_3

http://internet-apps.blogspot.com/2008/03/so-how-about-using-rdfa-in-microformat
s.html

Microsoft showed a strong commitment to XML with classes and
transforms. Will the company endorse Web 3 and produce more classes to
allow easier integration of Web 3 technologies and therefore more
transparency in Web applications?

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Arne Vajhøj - 23 Mar 2008 02:47 GMT

> Does anyone have details from Microsoft(eg press statements) about its
> commitment to C# and Web 3 technologies?
>
> Specifically, the role of C# and the use of RDF, Microformats and a
> higher level of data encapsulation.

> Microsoft showed a strong commitment to XML with classes and
> transforms. Will the company endorse Web 3 and produce more classes to
> allow easier integration of Web 3 technologies and therefore more
> transparency in Web applications?

I am sure that you can find lots of evidence that Microsoft is
strongly committed to .NET and C#.

It should be obvious that Microsoft will want to deliver
software and services for for the future web.

But we don't know how the web will look in 15 years. Microsoft
does not know it either.

Microsoft seems to believe that there will be a role for S+S.

I think you should ask in a marketing newsgroup or something
similar. This is not good forum for speculation.

Arne

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Logician - 23 Mar 2008 08:25 GMT

> > Does anyone have details from Microsoft(eg press statements) about its
> > commitment to C# and Web 3 technologies?
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> I am sure that you can find lots of evidence that Microsoft is
> strongly committed to .NET and C#.

Yes, but all technologies have short lives. C# is old. New
technologies are appearing every day.

I think the opportunity exists to broaden C# to incorporate new
classes to support Web 3 technologies. If not, C# will just vanish
like so many languages have lost their way: Smalltalk, COBOL, Java,
and many more.

> It should be obvious that Microsoft will want to deliver
> software and services for for the future web.

That is not obvious at all. Microsoft for example has failed to
dominate search (despite spending millions), and it missed out on the
browser market for years (only winning after length legal issues).
Microsoft has failed badly to judge the Web and it is now trying to
buying Yahoo! for billions in another attempt to again domination.
Therefore, it is not at all obvious that Microsoft will dominate the
Web in the future or even how strong the real want is at Microsoft
since the company still states that the PC market will dominate
business.

> But we don't know how the web will look in 15 years. Microsoft
> does not know it either.

Web 3 is happening now not 15 years from now. 15 years from now will
be Web 5 or Web 7.

> Microsoft seems to believe that there will be a role for S+S.

> I think you should ask in a marketing newsgroup or something
> similar. This is not good forum for speculation.

No these are technical issues. C# will die if the language will not
develop to support new thinking on the Web. You should read what
Berners-Lee is saying, or do you consider him a marketing person?

> Arne

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Jon Skeet [C# MVP] - 23 Mar 2008 08:38 GMT

> I think the opportunity exists to broaden C# to incorporate new
> classes to support Web 3 technologies. If not, C# will just vanish
> like so many languages have lost their way: Smalltalk, COBOL, Java,
> and many more.

Um, Java has in no way vanished...

Signature

Jon Skeet - <skeet@pobox.com>
http://www.pobox.com/~skeet Blog: http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK: http://iterativetraining.co.uk

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Jon Skeet [C# MVP] - 23 Mar 2008 09:01 GMT

<snip>

> I think the opportunity exists to broaden C# to incorporate new
> classes to support Web 3 technologies.

Please distinguish between C# as a language and .NET as a platform. I
doubt that C# will need to change for the sake of "Web 3" (whatever
that eventually means). I very much doubt that Microsoft will ignore
future web technologies when it comes to the framework.

Signature

Jon Skeet - <skeet@pobox.com>
http://www.pobox.com/~skeet Blog: http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK: http://iterativetraining.co.uk

Reply to this Message

Arne Vajhøj - 24 Mar 2008 00:02 GMT

> Yes, but all technologies have short lives. C# is old.

No - C# is young.

Programming languages have typical lifetimes of 20-40 years.

> I think the opportunity exists to broaden C# to incorporate new
> classes to support Web 3 technologies.

C# does not have classes - .NET have classes.

MS will likely add a thousand or more classes for each release
for each .NET version.

> If not, C# will just vanish
> like so many languages have lost their way: Smalltalk, COBOL, Java,
> and many more.

SmallTalk never caugth on.

Cobol is still alive after approx. 50 years.

Java is the most widely used programming language today.

>> It should be obvious that Microsoft will want to deliver
>> software and services for for the future web.
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> since the company still states that the PC market will dominate
> business.

want != succeed

I repeat: it is obvious that Microsoft want to deliver.

Whether they will succeed or not time will show.

>> But we don't know how the web will look in 15 years. Microsoft
>> does not know it either.
>>
> Web 3 is happening now not 15 years from now. 15 years from now will
> be Web 5 or Web 7.

Only if the marketing people decide to change the Web n.0 every
other year.

The substantial changes will take many years.

>> I think you should ask in a marketing newsgroup or something
>> similar. This is not good forum for speculation.
>
> No these are technical issues. C# will die if the language will not
> develop to support new thinking on the Web.

I think you should take a beginners training course in programming.

You can develop Web n.0 for any n in Cobol if you want to.

(I absolutely don't want to, but ...)

Web 1/2/3 has nothing to do with what language is used to implement
the services in.

> You should read what
> Berners-Lee is saying, or do you consider him a marketing person?

No.

Which is why I belive that he has never had said anything as
silly as the need to change C# to support the future of Web
(Web 3.0 if you prefer that term).

Arne

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clintonG - 23 Mar 2008 19:52 GMT

If you want to stay abreast of what Microsoft is doing and likely will do
(for the most part) you --must-- get involved with their research [1].

Hence, I can sum up the gist of the future of the platform for you in two
words: declarative programming.

<%= Clinton Gallagher

[1] http://research.microsoft.com/

> Does anyone have details from Microsoft(eg press statements) about its
> commitment to C# and Web 3 technologies?
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> allow easier integration of Web 3 technologies and therefore more
> transparency in Web applications?

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C# and Web 3

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